Dude, you are the man. The objects were not conencted to a layer, but at one time they were- there was a default layer input. I read a recent post you replyed to regarding a similiar issue, and you suggested going into the hypergraph and removing the connection to the default layer and this solved my problem. Thank you, your site is great as well, definately buying the book. Do me a favor and reply to my posts more often if you see them.