SGI computers

[sumatraxsi]

Hello, my name is Michael im 17 from Mississauga Ontario, I go to high school and working on my portfolio to school [collage] I have been using Maya and XSI at collage's that offer me the time to work on my stuff.
Finally my dad has agreed with me to get my own equipment now I will be getting my own computer but XSI and MAYA I will be getting from journey ed so i can catch up on new versions and features. This is my request I am intrested in buy a computer to run both software applications XSI and Maya I was thinking of a SGI computer mabe IRIX mabe NT/LINUX I would like to hear your opinions of a very good computer I can get from SGI or build myself I would like to hear the System Specs please so I can get a computer to support both applications and that will be good for me for updated versions thanks so much hopefully I will be hearing from people, I will really appreaciate this from everyone thanks. Also I am in the process on making a website the domain hasn't been purchased yet thats why im not giving out the name but it will be Maya and XSI I am looking for more people who are intrested in this website project if so leave me a message.
Sincerly Michael

[ozz-2005]

wow!..your dad is one rich man...
where about do you live?...mississauga road?..

-M-K-

http://homepages.go.com/~ambient_whisper/intro.htmlhttp://homepages.go.com/~ambient\_whisper/intro.html

[tito212]

If money is no object then an Octane is the one to get

For the best bang for the buck IMHO is a Dell Precision 330 or 420 with either a Wildcat 4110, Quadro 2 or a FireGL 2.

From Dell's web page:
A stock 420 with 384M and a Quadro 2 is ~3886.00.
A stock 330 with 384M and a FireGL2 is ~4336.00.

The 330 is a Pentium 4 and you will not be able to add an additional processor. The 420 will let you add another processor.

I would pass on the NT based SGI Visual Workstations.

[sumatraxsi]

Hey, It's me again thanks for the input no money is not really a consirn My dad is offering me about 20,000 on a computer but Im not willing to spend that all I have been checking out the SGI website The Octane2 is impressive which the prices atart around from $17,500 see my only problem with that is that I never have used IRIX plus I don't see any External storage's like Disk or any type how am i suppose to put my work on disk or something l8r on when putting my portfolio unfortunalty I havn't been able to work on IRIX box's so I wouldn't know if I could handle it I would like to see screenshots of it though if anyone can provide me it and information on irix I also heard i can put in X windows is this true if so great also another problem is internet features XSI is having internet features i heard irix users will miss out on this? I am going to be using XSI and MAYA and each time a new version releases i will be updating from journey Ed so please once Again I need more depth help on getting a computer for these two applications so far everyones input helping me out Im just looking more indepth and more discussion in IRIX cause i never used it screenshots and information on use would be great and how i can get external sotage like disk or something on a octane system. I was also thinking of Custom building my computer which im considering. So please more information twords IRIX SGI boxes and CUSTOM build computer cause i did hear that AMD is coming out with a 64bit processor Ghz also i heard that sgi is making the switch to intels 64bit processor to the IRIX box's. Well keep bringing the great input im sure more people are trying to put together or get a perfect machine in this type of buisness so this discussion really helps out me and alot of other people.
sincerly Michael.

[1000101-]

Howdy; I too am a poor student; and thusly I have to find ways of having a decent workstation for as little money as possible. As far as price/performance; I'd go with an NT or win2k based system over an IRIX system. especially since you want to use XSI on yer rig as well. I've seen alotta folks on the highend3d forums who say that XSI runs like dog poo on IRIX systems. given a 20 grand budget; and your lack of IRIX experience all together, I figure it'd be well spent on a home built workstation.
I figure in the next month or so; AMD will release their multi-CPU chipset. This means you'll have a choice of a dual pIII 1ghz or a dual AMD 1.2ghz system. I'd also stack it with uberloads of RAM; 512mb if you got the money. the PIII RAM will be more costly; as its RDRAM.
The AMD system might be able to outrender the intel system; I dunno if mental ray runs better on AMD or not. nor do I know if the maya batch renderer does. I do know that max's stock renderer performs noticably better on equivellently clocked AMD chips than Intel chips.. go figure.
You should be able to determine hard drive needs; since you know about how much data you'll be storing. The next big thing you'll need to snag is a video card. I've heard good things about the quadro (elsa gloria 2), so the quadro2 (gloria 3 when finally released) should be a decent improvement. it certainly costs more, 1400. I don't actually know anyone personally with a wildcat 4210; but for 5 grand it must do its job decently. I've never really been a big fan of oxygen cards; or the fireGL line..but I haven't used either in years.
as far as an IRIX based workstation though; they just cost too damned much money..
my two cents

[hnf]

Good Question !!!

from my point of view it should be definitly an octane or octane 2 i you can afford. reasons for this are the better flexibility of Irix. There are also some programms which are out only for sgi machines. e.g. Studiopaint. NT Boxes are also fine and definitly much cheaper, but when i look back i have reinstalled NT more then 30 times for sure and the SGI runs like the first day. another reason to choose the sgi for me is that you have a better "feeling" when you work. everything on IRIX is much clearer and more efficent.

so my advice : if you have really the money to buy SGi, then buy it, you will love it.

[dsunder]

If you go with Irix, get an Octane 2. If you go NT get a Zx10 (Intergraphs line now owned by SGI).

"I wouldn't want to be so cool in a world that's about to freeze"
-Jawbreaker

[ozz-2005]

you had to re-install win 30 times?..whoa...ive had 2k for almost one year straight...didnt have to reinstall yet...
still runnin fine..

-M-K-

http://homepages.go.com/~ambient_whisper/intro.htmlhttp://homepages.go.com/~ambient\_whisper/intro.html

[tjibbemaya]

"...see my only problem with that is that I never have used IRIX plus I don't see any External storage's like Disk..."

Stay away!!! IRIX is an extremely complicated OS to work with...especially if u know nothing about UNIX. Adding something like an external drive (optical, jaz, CDR) can be a nightmare to the untrained. I know, i spent 2.5 hours last night trying to get a zip to work on an O2.

More reasons to get a Win2k/NT box:
You're not stuck doing just 3D! With windows, you can actually edit your animations in a real program like AfterEffects (Composer sucks). With Win, you can pop in a DV FireWire Card and do digital video editing, compositing, and outputing. So you can mix your animations with live shots and output them back to tape. Its damn near impossible to find any hardware (drives, cards, printers, scanners, cameras, etc) that work with IRIX (and you'll want to import scanned pictures for your textures).

I have a friend with an O2 and he is dying to get a PC, an O2 for the home user is just not practical.

((( DePingus )))

[sumatraxsi]

Hey, Im back...I have been geting alot of great input from everyone which I really appreaciate, from what I have been reading I have found out new things for example that its possiable to put in a external Jaz drive in a IRIX box which i didn't think was possiable do to software not provided from IOMEGA on the other hand I have been leaning twords A custom made computer do to imputs like I can use other software as Photoshop for textures easy to use OS.
I still havn't made my decision yet but Im leaning more tworrds the custom made computer even though I would like to get the Octane 2 or a O2 and learn IRIX, Im just wondering what should I do I mean I can build a very good computer for NT/LINUx cause there is gonna be a linux XSI but what about MAYA since im looking to have both applications im gonna have to go with NT OS until or if Maya will make a Linux version. I have been getting imput like that to stay away from IRIX that its hard to learn I was wondering if someone could give me a brief explanation on how IRIX works looks etc If we look at Hardware I can build a good computer as the Octane 2 RIGHT? mabe even better Im thinking that most people complaints are twords the OS so im requesting Explanations on IRIX OS a brief workflow and gui if possiable to install Xwindows on IRIX so still im opening my options weather or not IRIX Octane2 or O2 or A custom build computer. I am leaning twords custom more do to more services and products for windows and linux Iv been hearing that you can put in much into a IRIX box... PLEASE more input:) thatnks alot
Sincerely Michael

[liquidpulse]

IRIX is a joke of an OS. It's just a wannabe Windows. It crashes all the time and is just plain ugly. Everyone I know who uses IRIX goes straight to the UNIX shell so what's the point of having IRIX.

As for the Octanes they're really slow. My PC opened up my Maya scene in 8 seconds while the Octane 2 took about 36.

[ozz-2005]

wannabe wndows..wasnt irix out before win?...just checking..

-M-K-

http://homepages.go.com/~ambient_whisper/intro.htmlhttp://homepages.go.com/~ambient\_whisper/intro.html

[dan-mcfarland]

I dont know where some of you have been using Irix but the hey "crap in crap out." "Everyone I know who uses IRIX goes straight to the UNIX shell ..." and yes children ice contains no water.?.?

Irix has its own GUI which is very simple to use. I came from Mac some time ago and the switch was very easy.
SGI's are used for two big reasons; 1 they can be networked, including almost unlimited storage and processors, ( why big buisnesses use them ) very easily and 2 they handle huge graphics files on screen with ease.
As far as processing power the 32 bit processors have snuck up on those with 64 bits. A couple of Athalons oc'd to 1400MHz would probably be faster than two 400Mhz Mips though.
Even when the Itantium comes out why pay $ 3-5 thousand for an un proven processor when you can buy a proven Mips or Sun forless than $ 2000.

One problem is that when you start texturing you cant use a newer version of Photoshop on the same machine. 3.0 is the latest for Irix.

When you start to add up costs 3000 for a wildcat, 3000 per P3 xenon and high speed disks the price difference between a unix and a good windows box is very small.

Just my .$02
Dan

[tjibbemaya]

IRIX is SGI's own variation of UNIX (which come in several different varieties, one of them being Linux). SGIs come with a GUI (Graphical User Interface) similar to X-Windows. Because its called X-"WINDOWS" doesn't mean it is anything like Microsoft Windows. Its graphical, it has 'windows' with stuff in it, and it has files and folders. The similaries stop there. There is no such thing as Plug & Play, no simple control panel. If you want to make a system change, in stead of going to device manager, you go to the UNIX Shell. Which at first glace reselmbles the old DOS Prompt (except its far more unintuitive than that). Now its time to start issueing more cryptic commands to try to get very expensive and hard to find peripherals (because just any old peripheral wont work on an SGI) to work.

Heres what I went through the other night getting a Zip Drive to work on my friends O2:

First, he purchased a SCSI Zip 250. The 250mb models do not work. He returned it and went to get a 100mb model. But he couldn't find a SCSI 100 anywhere (i think they dont make them anymore). All he could find was the USB 100. USB does not work on an SGI. So I let him borrow my old SCSI Zip100. After that, we had to spend $40 on 2 adapters to plug in that zip (luckily he already had the $50 cable needed for the scsi-3 connector on the rear of the O2). IRIX automatically recognizes this (and only this) very old zip drive. The same thing happens with the Jazz Drives.

Heres a little test for you. Get on the internet and look for a scanner that supports the IRIX OS. If you happen to find one, compare the price to an equivalent scanner for Windows.

In retort to the person talking about networking and multiprocessor systems...Back in the 70's, 80's and early to mid '90s, UNIX was king of the net. Now that Windows has matured as an OS, it is quickly taking over the networking community. I went to a school with about 60 SGI O2s all networked. Many projects were lost and corrupted because of this network.

It is incredibly easier to administer a WindowsNT/2k network than a UNIX network. And a PROPERLY managed windows network is faster than a sloppy, cryptic UNIX one.

For the single computer, HOME user/hobbiest/student/professional, a windows workstation is the way to go. I can't see anyone who has WORKed in both enviroments saying anything different.
If you're a big studio and can purchase a whole bunch of SGIs to setup a network just for Maya, XSI, and rendering, and then buy a whole bunch of G4s to do your video and post, and then some PCs, just for the hell of it, and a large, skilled IT staff...then go go for it! Otherwise, for just one machine you will not be happy with your O2 (especially if you have friends doing 3D and other stuff on their PCs).

PS
i love unix

((( DePingus )))

[cyphre]

My advice is to go with a custom made pc and use win 2k. Everyone is right. SGIs, intergraphs and everything else are nice, but your paying for the name mostly. I'm sure if the SGI name was on a 486 they would cost about as much as most people home computers. Instead of wasting your money, go with a less expensive computer that you build yourself. With whatever money you have left spend it on software like 3ds max, maya, xsi, lightwave, whatever. The more the merrier. Figure out what you want to do in the industry. Whether it's modeling, texturing, animating, rendering, game work, fx, whatever and study how to do it on all the software. If you have talent also you'll be a shoe in for a job.
As for whats the best way to build it. You don't need to go over board. you could get along fine with a dual processor 700 pIII and a ton of ram, minium 512. I mean, hell if I could build anything I wanted I would probably build the biggest fastest thing I could, but I have used horrible machines and learned ways to optimize scenes and object without lossing quality. Remember it's just a machine, if you don't learn the right way to do something, the fastest machine in the world isn't going to help you.

Cyphre

[stuartscanlon]

Worked on O2 for 2 and a half years. Never had previous experience working on Irix. Ran 24/7/365.25. Crashed Twice. Steps needed to install Jaz drive that would mount Mac Format, Irix format, Windose format; 1 power down, 2 connect Jaz, 3 power up (ok, maybe this is 2 steps, power up Jaz, power up O2) 4, Jam Cartidge into slot.

Now I am on a PC. Number of crashes will be measured on a per day basis now. I also have one at home. I will in a later (much later) post tell you, when I am finished (and when my buddy the $85/hour tech is finished) how many steps it takes to get a USB Zip drive to work.

As far as network ease of set-up. It is easy to set up a windows network if you know windows. It is easy to set up an Irix network if you know Irix. It is easiest to set up a Mac network, period.

As far as windows being the choice for networks and servers. Well, when it comes to mission critical applications... It's UNIX. Sorry, just true. Ask the DOD, or any sizeable dot com. Windows simply sucks at the enterprise level.

If you were just going to do Maya, I would say wait 3 months and buy a Mac. I got one whirring away right next to my PC at work, you know, the one that crashes daily. I think it might have crashed sometime last spring. Hard to recall, definatley less stable than the old O2.

but, if you are at home, need XSI as well as Maya, and money was no object, I would buy an Integraph, enjoy the speed, and suffer the OS.

cheers

have a lovely day

[jtk77]

Seriously look into the SGI Intergraph ZX10
You can get an awsome one for about 12 grand.

.............

[linthicum6]

hmm better stay away from Irix as far as using Edu software cause no one supports it not even Journeys Ed!!
Irix is cool but if your just starting out then better get on NT cause Irix is not an easy system to deal with in the long run due to costs in support and parts.
Ive used both and still do plus Mac and Im still depending on NT for Maya!!

Maya Abuser

[cyphre]

Don't get a mac unless forced to by gun point. As stated by a few others in a post on hardware or something the best card you can get is an ati with like 32 megs. Plus, Mac's aren't as good as they used to be. Yes they used to be the #1 for graphics. Now a days I would take an NT over a Mac. Truely they are better. A mac can crash just as much as a NT. Nt's don't crash much unless you or someone else installed it wrong some how or are just on a crappy computer.

Cyphre

[goesb]

As far as the crashing on NT goes, most of the crashes that i have experienced is caused not by the OS, but by the Application that i was working on.
Maya, crashes, but NT/win2k remains stable.

...reinstalling NT 30 times is abit extreme, but i don't think it's because of NT it self. Upgrade to win2k

I would have to suggest getting some Dual Processor PC boxes....networking rendering...yum.